真三雙王！大O羅伯特森60-66年460場NBA比賽場均三雙|威少更甚？

美國JRS之聲

真三雙王！大O羅伯特森60-66年460場NBA比賽場均三雙|威少更甚？

Oscar Robertson didn"t just average a triple double over the 1961-1962 season but over 460 games cumulatively from 1960 through 1966.

真三雙王-大O奧斯卡羅伯特森不光光是在1961-1962賽季拿到了場均三雙。他在1960-1966這段時間內的460場比賽做到了場均3雙……

30.4 ppg, 10.0 rpg, 10.7 apg through 1960-1966.

場均30.4分+10板+10.7助攻……

[–][UTA] Dante ExumDhylan18 42 指標 1 天前

But Oscar Robertson did only average a triple double for one entire season

In 60-61 he had 10.1 rebounds 9.7 assists

In 62-63 he had 10.4 rebounds 9.5 assists

In 63-64 he had 9.9 rebounds 11 assists

In 64-65 he had 9.0 rebounds 11.5 assists

In 65-66 he had 7.7 rebounds 11.1 assists

So while he did average a triple double for 7 seasons he only had one complete season of of averaging a triple double. His all time triple double record is still far away from Westbrooks total

但他真的只有一個完整的賽季拿到了場均三雙。

60-61賽季，場均10.1板，9.7助攻

62-63賽季，場均10.4版板，9.5助攻

63-64賽季，場均9.9籃板，11助攻

64-65賽季，場均9.0籃板，11.5助攻

65-66賽季，場均9.0籃板，11.5助攻

所以他確實七個賽季加起來場均三雙，但他只在一個完整的賽季能拿到場均三雙。他的總三雙次數還是遙遙領先於威斯布魯克。

[–][SAS] Boban Marjanovickorny12345 15 指標 1 天前

And he averaged about 44 minutes a game. Much different NBA. Impressive none the less.

他場均能上場44分鐘，跟現在的NBA很不一樣，但還是很讓人吃精的數據。

[–]San Diego ClippersJellyfishSammich 18 指標 1 天前

To be fair Wilt probably averaged a triple double over several seasons if Blocks had been counted back then.

講道理，如果說當時有人數蓋帽的話，張伯倫有幾個賽季應該也是場均三雙。

[–][GSW] Draymond GreenChubbsDaddy 5 指標 1 天前

lol dude they literally they had like 30 more possessions per game. It was all run and gun and shoot and miss. Thats why so many people averaged crazy rebound numbers.

哈哈哈哈說真的老哥，他們那個時候一場比賽的回合數能比現在多30次。就是跑了投，投了丟。這也是為啥當時那麼多人能拿到那麼多籃板的原因。

[–]SpursDimaaaa 5指標 1 天前

Wait until Russ finds out. He"s gonna average a triple-double for the rest of his career.

威少知道這個事之後。他估計剩下的職業生涯就要場均三雙了

[–]ThunderSoldatJ 23 指標 1 天前

We love the flashy players of today and how they push new limits. George Mikan was a huge influence on basketball being played the way it is today, but it"s easy to ask why he was such a big deal when any D-League bench rider today could have torched the competition in his era. People don"t think about things like an era when goaltending was allowed and how Mikan and the ABA gave the 3 point line the exposure it needed for the game to be what it is today.

我們都很喜歡看現在那些打球花哨的球員，以及他們不斷的推高極限。喬治麥肯對於現今的籃球風格有很大的影響，鑒於現今任何一個發展聯盟的球員都可以去統治那個年代的比賽，可能有很多人都想問我為啥會這麼說。主要還是因為大家沒考慮在當時是允許干擾球的，以及麥肯和當時的ABA聯賽給了三分線足夠的上鏡機會，三分才會在現今這麼流行。

[–]filigreed_is_good 26 指標 1 天前

I didn"t know that - but isn"t it also true that 1960s pace inflated every stat, making it

這些我還真不知道，但1960年代的比賽節奏確實讓每項數據都膨脹了，有道理的。

[–]RaptorsYoubestnotmisss 81 指標 1 天前

BBref has 1962 pace estimated at 126.2 possessions per game, with royals at 124.9

2017 pace is 96.2 with Thunder at 97.6

If we adjust Thunder"s pace to Royals pace it"s a difference of 28%

So if we adjust Westbrook"s base stats to that pace it becomes

40.2 ppg, 13.6 RPG, 13.2 APG

Oscar was 30.8, 12.5, 11.4

If we adjust for minutes (arguably not fair as production per minute can decrease with more minutes), westbrook is at

55.6 points, 18.8 rebounds, 18.2 assists per 48 minutes

Oscar is at

33.4 points, 13.5 rebounds, 12.4 assists per 48 minutes

BBR給出的數據1962年的皇家隊場均有126.2個回合，得到124.9分。

2017年的雷霆場均96.2回合，得到97.6分

如果我們把雷霆帶入到皇家隊的數據中，就產生了28%的差距。

把威斯布魯克的數據換算到126個回合中，就是：

場均40.2分，13.6個籃板，13.2次助攻。

如果換算成相同的比賽時間（可能這個比較不太公平，因為每個人的產出會隨著上場時間的上升而下降）

威斯布魯克的數據是每48分鐘55.6分，18.8個籃板，以及18.2次助攻。

大O的數據是場均33.4分，13.5個籃板，12.4個助攻。

[–]WarriorsGrandpaGunther 329 指標 1 天前

Pace matters. What Westbrook is doing this season blows Oscar out of the water when you account for it.

比賽的節奏很關鍵，這樣算的話，威斯布魯克這個賽季要把大O爆出翔了。

[–]Spurs_enebea 130 指標 1 天前

Also opponents" skill level was way lower than it is today.

同樣當時對手的技術水平也比現在要低。

[–]Knicksazizinator25 299 指標 1 天前

Yeah but if you"re going to say that you also have to at least mention the fact that Russell basically has infinity times more advantages than Robertson did in terms of proper nutrition, training, gear, film review, etc. Also, while I can"t guarantee this, I would imagine that Russell had a far higher quality of life growing up in LA in the 90s and early 2000s then Robertson did growing up in segregated Indiana in the 40s.

I see so much dismissal of players from the older eras, but very few people even acknowledge the fact that current players have so many more advantages, those advantages alone make eras nearly incomparable.

但這樣算的話，你最少也要提一下，威斯布魯克在營養，訓練，裝備，觀看錄像獲得的便利比大O不知道要好了多少倍。還有，威少是在90年代以及21世紀早期的洛杉磯長大，而大O可是在40年代還在實行種族隔離的印第安納長大的，這樣看威少又比大O有了很多優勢。

我看到很多人在網上不認可上古時代的球星們，但卻很少有人承認現今的球員有優勢的地方太多了，這些優勢是那些時代根本比不上的。

[–]Spurs_enebea 39 指標 1 天前

I agree with you that Russel had advantages in health and training due to being born in a different era but he"s still way better. Baseball is pretty good at acknowledging that players nowadays are way better than those from the 50s and 60s but for some reason basketball fans have a panic attack when someone mentions that players nowadays are competing against way better competition. It"s not even close.

我同意說威少在維持健康以及訓練上面有優勢，因為他生在了一個物質條件更好的年代。棒球迷就很認同說現在的球員比5，60年代的球員強很多，但是不知道為啥，一有人說現在球員面對的競爭比當時強很多，就有人要被嚇出毛病了。但實際上，真的差距很大。

[–]Bulletskubideh_kaczynski 291 指標 1 天前

why can"t we ever just appreciate oscar without bringing up somebody else

he"s one of the 5 most important people in the history of the game, not just a foil for whoever you think is overrated today

為什麼不能不提別人，靜靜的享受大O的比賽呢。

他可能是籃球史上最重要的五個人之一，而不是現在每次你一想到誰被高估時候，就把他拿出來做襯托。

[–]Cavaliersbizzbob 120 指標 1 天前

now this is an argument i can get on board with, people try to rank these past greats in terms of what they could do on the court today and they always overrate them because guys today have 100000 more advantages to maximize their game

but when it comes to importance, these guys from the 60-80s are why today"s players live in mansions, some of these all time greats had 2nd jobs for christ"s sake and it wasn"t that long ago.

the salary CAP was less than $4,000,000 in the mid 80s and vet mins were $65,000

these old school guys did all the dirty work for today"s guys

dudes like wilt and oscar are owed a lot by today"s players and fans

這個話題我可以來插兩句。人們總是喜歡通過比較上古超巨們在現在的比賽里可以做到什麼來比較他們，然後就容易高估他們，因為現在的球員有無數多的便利來使他們的比賽技能最大化。

但比起來重要性的話，正是那些60-80年代的運動員的存在，才會讓現在的球員有機會住在豪宅里，這些歷史級別的球星們，甚至好要打第二份工，這也是不久前才發生的事。

80年代中期的工資帽不到400萬美元，當時的老將底薪只有65000美金。

這些老牌球員為現在的球員們鋪好了登上榮光的道路。

現在的球員和球迷們虧欠像張伯倫和大O這樣的球員太多太多。

[–][CHA] Kemba WalkerDhalphir 21 指標 23小時前

and before someone brings up "muh inflationz" to counter your point, $4m in 1985 would be equal to roughly $9m now.

在有人提出所謂「通貨膨脹「來反駁你之前，我先告訴大家當時的400萬不過等於現在的900萬而已。

[–][OKC] Russell Westbrookkrasilov 10 指標 23小時前

Is that even Mozgov money?

這夠付莫茲戈夫的工資么？

[–]Robpd22 24 指標 23小時前

Mozgov money fun fact: Last night Mozgov shot 7/7 with 9 rebounds 2 assists 1 steal and 0 turnovers.

一個關於莫茲戈夫工資的有趣事實：昨晚莫茲戈夫7投7中，9板，2助攻，1搶斷還沒失誤。

[–]simonlyw 11 指標 23小時前

Give him the max!

這表現必須頂薪奉上。

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